New visit to Paragon

grecian · Post by **grecian** » Fri Oct 02, 2009 11:32 am

Nil Satis and I had another jaunt up to Games Warehouse HQ yesterday to have a look at some of their new product. Some details and thoughts on the games we saw are as follows:

A general theme on the new product is that GWHL seem to be going for the "next game bonus" idea in a big way - the idea being that the game hooks you in by offering you some sort of goodie next time round. Have to say I like this idea, and think it will probably become the norm - it's a good way to get Joe Public (or for that matter a high-level player) to have another go.

BATTLESHIPS - this is one of seemingly two or three versions of the old classic which are coming out at the moment (I played a different version on an Ind:e the other week). I'd have to say I didn't particularly warm to the GWHL variant. Graphically it has a rather grey, austere look redolent of a submarine or military vessel. The maingame is the standard Battleships set up - the grid is 10x10, and although there are no 1x1 ships, it still looks like it would take a while to clear (and did on the occasion I managed it). There's some nice little touches on the bonuses here which will amuse those who like fripperies. The big problem for me is the endgame, which essentially involves selecting squares in another 10x10 grid which either contain a low (e.g. 10p-40p) prize increment, a "bank prizes already won" token, or a "game over" taken which ends the game and loses all unbanked prizes. The player also has an option to exit the game at any point and collect whatever he's banked and won up to that point. The trouble is it takes an age to build up the sort of prize a decent player would think worth collecting (e.g., say, £4 or £5), by which time you'll have been gameovered. I suspect prizes of £2 or so will be the norm on this, so I see this as very much appealing to Joe Public rather than keener players. This uses a "next game bonus".

BY ANY MEANS - ggdr has described this fully at viewtopic.php?t=14232 so I won't reiterate the game idea. Putting aside the total bizarreness of a game based on such a low-profile show, this game does have a lovely look to it and I concur that Istenem's pans may be in danger. I'm not sure I'd go as far to say it's "rubbish" (I think on three goes on it I did manage to win a prize of £3 or something), but my fear is that it is very controlled in the manner of some recent GWHL titles such as Doctor Who (although see below) or MOTD, i.e. it will suddenly switch from nice questions to brutal ones at one point in the game. There is also the point that the miles concept ggdr describes offers another opportunity for the game to clam up - we feared a Zeno's paradox sort of situation where each time the game gives you half as many miles as you need to complete the round.

I think both the above titles are at some test sites at the moment, and should be coming out over the next couple of months more widely.

BLOCKBUSTER - this is a non-trivia Breakout clone. The player moves the paddle across the screen by using the touch screen, so it builds on from that path-tracing game which was used last time - both are clearly an attempt to widen the use of touch screen technology. I'm pretty hopeless at this sort of thing, so hardly played it, but I can imagine this could be popular if they've avoided the temptation to introduce blatant elements of unfairness to penalise good players (which I understand was a problem on the path-tracing game). Cash prizes of up to £10 I think.

MATCH OF THE DAY 2 - this is actually very different from MOTD 1 although shares exactly the same branding, graphics and music. It's not a quiz game at all, but is instead a football-themed version of something like Pints Make Prizes. I didn't play it much but can imagine playing it a bit when it comes out. I would imagine that this will very strongly appeal to the many fans of missing letter games on this forum. I think this might not be out until a while after, say, By Any Means and Battleships - I suspect it was still only at internal testing stage. Anyway, after the departure of Football Crazy and ItBox Soccer from the market, good to see a football-themed missing letter game return. This isn't intended to replace MOTD1, but will instead be in addition to it. I've not really got into MOTD 1, but understand it is doing well with punters and here to stay.

DOCTOR WHO: REVENGE OF THE DALEKS - this is meant to be a revamp of Doctor Who with some of the elements that make Doctor Who such an annoying game improved a bit. One of my criticisms of Doctor Who has always been the uneven gradation of questions - easy stuff for a round or two, then a sudden switch to brutality, and I am told that ROTD might improve things on that front. Too early to tell from my couple of plays, but it did look a bit better in that respect. Another change is that one always has to answer X questions to gain X moves now - not sure why they've changed that but it means that it doesn't really matter what subject you choose, which has got to be welcome. And there's also been a "next game bonus" added to this as well - one of the ones I got was quite generous and enabled me to win £4 the next go. All in all I thought this did look much more tempting, and look forward to seeing whether that's really the case when it's out.

As to what will be disappearing, three games were named - Track and Field will be going after just one issue. I think the general feeling is that it just hasn't worked - games take too long, punters have found it almost impossible to reach the prize level, and have found the endgame far too tough when they have. Personally, I'll miss it, although there's no denying the bug on the penultimate level of the endgame is a shoddy affair. I think there's a good game hiding somewhere in T&F, but am not sure there's any plans to revitalise it. Frogger is also going, more because of lapse of time I think. Can't remember what the third game going is, but it wasn't anything I would shed a tear for.

kingzilla · Post by **kingzilla** » Fri Oct 02, 2009 12:12 pm

How do you go about getting a visit to GW mate?
Seems a little risky for them

grecian · Post by **grecian** » Fri Oct 02, 2009 12:45 pm

kingzilla wrote:How do you go about getting a visit to GW mate?
Seems a little risky for them

I got approached on here: I think they decided they wanted the input of a couple of proper players on their product, and presumably decided from my posts that I was likely to have some useful feedback. Obviously an element of trust involved from them, and also I'm conscious that I wouldn't want to be viewed as a GWHL mouthpiece on here (on reflection, I was too kind on the last set of games, but they looked good to me on first play and it often takes a while to work out what's a good game or not).

Nil Satis · Post by **Nil Satis** » Fri Oct 02, 2009 12:58 pm

grecian wrote:I think they decided they wanted the input of a couple of proper players on their product

That was indeed the background; not sure how I 'slipped through the net' then!

As for any concerns of being seen as a mouthpiece for GWHL, hopefully my descriptions of many of their games in the past will have put that to rest long ago! Nice people though, and I really do mean that - it has been great to meet some of the real people behind the games and machines that I have misspent far too much of my youth playing.

QuizMaster · Post by **QuizMaster** » Fri Oct 02, 2009 2:10 pm

Fuck me Dr. Who couldn't get any worse. Sounds like you're right pally with them. Can't say I've been approached - anybody else been asked?

Slammer · Post by **Slammer** » Fri Oct 02, 2009 3:55 pm

Perhaps GWHL could find 5Mb on a DVD to put the Tetris game back on!

AFAIK it had no over-payout issues and I used to love playing it and competing with mates... (and im not the only one)

Why they took it off on v5 I just dont understand. They actually had a popular skill game that didnt result in empty hoppers and removed it ?!?
(and I know its popular because you can tell from the highscore tables all over the country!!).

Bearing in mind v5 actually has a SKILL game tab...

fotherz · Post by **fotherz** » Fri Oct 02, 2009 10:54 pm

Is it cynical to suggest that these operators are really just looking for top-end players to establish the right difficulty at which to pitch their games?

Careful boys.

cool · Post by **cool** » Fri Oct 02, 2009 11:31 pm

'Is it cynical to suggest that these operators are really just looking for top-end players to establish the right difficulty at which to pitch their games?'

Nil Satis/grecian

top end players?

I beat quizmaster to the draw

wires74 · Post by **wires74** » Sat Oct 03, 2009 9:20 am

tend to agree with fotherz be very
Careful

Istenem · Post by **Istenem** » Sat Oct 03, 2009 10:46 am

maybe a fair comment Fotherz but SWP is a hobby and not a job for most people, and those with an innate bent for discovery are predisposed to books, learning and opportunity. the people who distribute SWP are well aware that such a person exists who can do better at games than the makers; i'd suggest that there is a deal of mutual admiration in this too. it is not a big secret.

if there is some kind of PTAesque liaison, it can't be a bad thing. (the teachers are surely good at their job but the knowledge and experience of wider professionalism can only improve the service.) Grecian and Nil Satis seem to me to be good representatives of the playing public, albeit immeasurably better than the people who make the industry viable for the developers.
it is too easy to overlook this point from an ivory tower: while we might make a few quid from playing these, SWP wouldn't exist if they were not playable for a wider (much wider) public who ultimately fund development, hardware, siting, upkeep, overheads, maintenance and every other aspect of a commercial entity.

it is one thing to moan on here about things which don't suit us for whatever reason* but quite another to moan when we are given a mouthpiece at the market leader. i think it is entirely progressive that people from here have given up their time to accept GWHL's invitation. no doubt it is something of a busman's holiday but still a viable conduit.
i'd be wholly open about my interests in the SWP sphere, you are all aware that my hollowware gets spattered with jizz when the green plane flies by on south park and i seen no reason to be coy amongst a sympathetic crowd. i'm looking forward to the new travel game; i don't know what a charley boorman is but it sounds right up my street with the bells and whistles. and the introduction of this next-game-bonus thingie looks like an inspired move, i hope it works well.

if there was some mahoosive flaw in new product which could be exploited, there would be a conflict of classiness and chutzpah, i think we can trust the scruples and integrity from two of our own. the developers know that 30% of the money in is paid out and they would probably prefer this to be spread evenly amongst punters, but they are not naïve enough to imagine that there is no faster gun in the west.

*Dear GWHL, can you please fix the problem with vanishing prizes when you press collect too soon and take those bloody 20pees out of the hopper? oh, and any chance of putting family fortunes on your terminals?
love from Istenem.

wires74 · Post by **wires74** » Sat Oct 03, 2009 11:03 am

poacher turned gamekeeper analogy is definitely
One to be avoided

roberto la vigna · Post by **roberto la vigna** » Sat Oct 03, 2009 11:49 am

Cud u put Word Flipper on teh nxt ish, plz? kthx

quizard · Post by **quizard** » Sat Oct 03, 2009 2:48 pm

So in return for your input did they give you you the secret code to activate the boom switch?

Matt Vinyl · Post by **Matt Vinyl** » Sat Oct 03, 2009 3:22 pm

I was invited, but sadly a family bereavement prevented me from going.

So they're certainly not limiting it to pro-players. lol. Although part o my invite was for other reasons. Hoping I'll be able to make a visit in the future...

cool · Post by **cool** » Sat Oct 03, 2009 3:59 pm

any idea of the date of the next update?