FOBT - why its' not like _casino roulette

Roulette, Poker, Blackjack. Discuss your methods / experiences here.
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JG
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Post by JG »

If life was always straightforward and easy, it wouldn't exist in the first place.
JG
Northern Monkey
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Post by Northern Monkey »

harry2 wrote:Create your own roulette on excel by typing

=RANDBETWEEN(0,36) and copying down the formula.
Ha- zero came out second spin.
Northern Monkey
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Post by Northern Monkey »

harry2 wrote:Create your own roulette on excel by typing

=RANDBETWEEN(0,36) and copying down the formula.
and actually H its also strangely addictive.
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harry2
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Post by harry2 »

nr89 wrote:FOBT's should be illegal. I have spent my last 14 months of wages on them, most of the time only playing them with the intention of spending £10 but quite often turning into £200 sessions. I have put the maximum straight of £13 a good( or bad) 20 times and never hit. My maximum number is a £7 straight on 16 which i was surprised even come out. I have overdrafted my bank account to chase* my losses back to no avail. Addiction to FOBT's has caused me to have debts with my bank, lose my car, tested relationships with family. I always end up needing bailed out. Personally I think its all bullshit but very addictive. Im an arse. But a recovering one :)

* Like a headless chicken.
Unfortunately it gets a lot of people. Try gamcare (honestly) or self exclude.
Roulette free since December 2011.
dazza33
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Post by dazza33 »

Just read through the thread all theories or here say including my own. The bottom line is long term you cant win if game is straight the house edge gets you. If fixed the conclusion is obvious. The sad thing is some gamblers get addicted and the bookmakers just take their money with no conscience. I stopped playing a while back and am better off without the fobts
Joe
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WARNING WARNING do not play FOBT WARNING

Post by Joe »

A friend of mine works for one of companies that run these evil machines and they know these things wreck lives, they ARE definately fixed in favour of the bookies and yes its a lot more than 2.7%, they adjust the percentages constantly so they maximise profit, they are pure EVIL.
anyone who plays these is a mug. if you want to gamble then go into the casino, you get true odds there.

when they introduced these they paid out, this is called a loss leader, this means they got everyone interested and now they are reaping the rewards big time.

stop playing these evil things and watch the bookies suffer.
Spyder
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Post by Spyder »

nr89 wrote:I have put the maximum straight of £13 a good( or bad) 20 times and never hit.
so you expect to hit a 36/1 bet at least once within 20 instances?.. do you even understand the game you are playing?

would you expect to flip a coin to heads on the first spin? or on the second??

so if you bet on one number, would you expect it to come out within 36 spins? or 72? or later? afterall, if it systematicly steps all the way around the wheel one number at a time, there are 16 positions that wouldnt get to your number within this time?
Joe
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Post by Joe »

leisure link but he says they all do the same thing, they are scum and fix everything, the servers are hosted in offshore and cant be scruitinised, just like william hill poker (which is well fixed - too many showdowns) which is hosted from cyprus and no one has jurestiction to look at the data.

believe me people do not play any fobt machines and do not play william hill poker.

I personally only play betfair poker and play true odds in the casino and I am quite happy in the feeling I know its true odds.
Joe
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Post by Joe »

they dont check anything, its all crap mate, they just give them a bit of software and say there you go random numbers, they dont check in real play in the shop which is what they should, if they did they would know that there is too many near missus u bet 26 comes up 15 then the next spin the other side 0 so it entices you too play more. this happend every single time anyone plays these rigged pieces of sh1t.

DONT PLAY AND WATCH THE BOOKIES START SHUTTING SHOPS. HATE THEM WITH A VENGANCE.
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Scott
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Post by Scott »

I love fobts, pull up a stool, a big wad of £20's and crack on, hours of fun :D



Long live the fobt!!!
Cobwebs 👆
Valdrin89
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Fixed Odds Betting Terminals

Post by Valdrin89 »

As we all know they were introduced in 2004 and have become the reason why bookmakers are still a high street business as they represent the majority of their profits. Bookmakers admittedly would not make the profit margins necessary to survive with racing events alone.
 
In many forums you notice the same question is asked time and time again. The question is “Is FOBT roulette random”. Despite bookmakers claiming they are many arguments have been put forward as to why they are not. Here as some examples:
 
1.      Why do the machines seem to generate red numbers if I am chasing black, 19-36 when I am chasing 1-18 and so on?
2.      With some machines you can tell you have won or lost immediately after you have pressed the button - applies to the majority of FOBT simulation computer programmes.
3.      Why does it seem to pay more in the afternoon/evenings and less in the mornings?
4.      Why single number repetitions are so common is such a short history of numbers. I.e. number 18 appearing four times in ten spins.
 
Now all bookmakers advertise that their FOBT roulette is random, the same claim is made for every program within it. So that would be roulette, blackjack, fruit machines etc. You can find the exact wording they use by going onto the help screen and selecting the help option. They claim the machines are random because they are connected via the internet to a single point (some sort of communal server) which its sole purpose is to generate random events. In the case of roulette it is random numbers. The server if I can call it that generates a random event every second. This means once you have placed your bets using the touch screen interface and have pressed the button then you are dealt a number at random and the machine deciphers weather the random number was winner or a looser in that particular spin.      
 
This means that the number history is simply there for aesthetic purposes because at most you can only spin once every 3 - 4 seconds therefore the number history is not indicative of anything. You can argue that when bearing in mind the above then getting 20 red numbers in a row does not sound that implausible.  You could also argue that each event is absolutely random and chasing a red, black. 1-18, 19-36 etc is pointless as you are not getting the accumulative odds against and the number(s) you seek, because the may have been generated up 3 - 4 time at the very least in between your spins.
 
Despite the above I carried out a sequence of tests recently where I attempted to try the most common systems which help maximise odds of winning in a conventional roulette machines. One of which was the following:
 
Red/Black/High Low Chase
 
Placing 0.20p on each six number split leaving zero blank. Therefore, limiting the exposure to zero coming up from £2, when placing £1 on red and black, to £1.20. With an £300 balance I span until I reached a situation where there was three sequential reds, black, evens, odds etc.
 
Then followed the following wager structure.
   
1.     £1
2.     £2
3.     £4
4.     £8
5.     £16
6.     £32
7.     £64
 
Anyone knows that odds for the same event to occur several consecutive times in a series of independent plays of a game are very low. This applies for any game of chance, including roulette. For clarity lets suppose we have a situation was there has been three black in a row and you decide to start placing structured wagers on red (see above structure). The idea here is that over a period of time you should maintain a decent profit on the basis that getting ten blacks in a row is a very unlikely possibility.
 
The odds of a black number appearing at anytime are 18/37 which is roughly 0.49% in decimal odds, basically almost 50/50. You cannot use this system is casinos because they have large outside betting limits (£25min and £500 table limit). The odds of getting ten blacks in a row are therefore 0.49% to the power of ten (which is a lot) or 0.07%. Mathematically speaking you will get ten black in ten spins only 0.07% of the time.
 
Conclusion
 
The outcome was somewhat predictable. Although I am aware of the fact the number history is not indicative of anything. I noted some very interesting patters appear. For example when spinning the roulette for zero probability - meaning chasing the three sequence event i.e. three black, red, odds etc the number history appeared quite normal and varied. However, once I got the desired sequence and started chasing a specific colour, odd, evens etc I noted the number history changed considerably by generating predominantly red numbers when I was chasing black and black when I was chasing red, and etc.
 
I tired this method in various machines within a single shop and in various other shops and the outcome was always the same. Although I didn’t lose much I could see the machine recognised I was playing a system and I had to stop because losing seemed a guarantee. That fact is a machine which is truly random cannot recognise betting patterns.  
 
I did also note a very strange event. Feel free to try this for yourselves. Bearing in mind the machines operate from a single communal number generator then if you spin two machines simultaneously you should expect the same outcome every time. For example if one machine spins zero as long as the adjacent machine was spun simultaneously you should also expect zero.     
 
Sure enough when I tried it with a zero profitability spin (£1 on black and red in each machine), both machines span the same numbers time after time barring the odd time I didn’t manage to spin them simultaneously. However, when I tried spinning the same two machines for profit (one with £1 on black and the other with £1 on red) the numbers were always different, predominantly resulting in a loss on both machines. Again I tried this on many machines and in many shops and the outcome was the same.
 
In conclusion how can bookmakers possibly state the machines are random when the clearly are not. This is clear misinformation and they should not be able to do this.
 
Your comments are welcome[/b]
ruthl3ss
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hmmm

Post by ruthl3ss »

the aliens are a comming
gaztarra
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Post by gaztarra »

there rigd to death....a few questions!!!!!!!!!!why does the ball jump,screen freeze/jerk?why does it always kill martingales?why after a loss & you hit repeat,does it spin same number and kill u again?why does it never ball jump if u bc red or black!!why are they bastards in the morning to play..here is proof there not totaly random,,,,the machine displays a pay ratio..20 % ect,so for every 100 it takes 20% is paid out"on avridge""the machines display a pay out %"not the zero house edge as in a casino game of roulette!!!!ask yaself this..how?can a RANDOM game,,also have a pay out ratio?which is anything but 2.7 %"the zero edge"..how can something totaly random be governd by a 20% pay ratio,how?on a totaly random game they would have no control what so ever over the payouts!!!they are a hybrid(half random and half fruit machine with predertimend pay and take ratios...any thoughts??
gaztarra
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f.o.b.t reality!

Post by gaztarra »

its gaz again,thanks for the welcome!!!!!!
this is the first forum i have ever joined,ive skand for months & months,i did not want to get in to a rand or not debate!!but here goes-roulette has a houce percentage of 2.7%in most casinos!!the f.o.b.t machines have a pay out percentage of between 30 &20 %...here lies the question!!how can a truly random game AND a 20/30 % payout go hand in hand?
has for it repeating the number to kill you,what i actualy mean is that this happens way too much on avridge!
in ma heart i believe those that have realy played them & hopefully real roulette"casino"not R.N.G..know for a fact there not random and are rigd..so i do not have to try convince them,,
i want to talk/debate with these people.shre there thoughts and feelings on them and how they play,,,ps.the screen jerk/ball jump happens in coral & will hill all the time....ps,,thanks for the welcome again! :D
Spyder
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Post by Spyder »

house vs player statistics and "edge" / rake is ONLY if played with an exact mathematical strategy, which is pointless as it is random, with slight variance due to atmospherics
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