id love to see who walks into a £100,000 a year job?
if machines were taken away tomorrow morning and there was a law making them all out of service foreever every single one of you would either be on the dole, or taking the first £5 an hour job you could find.. as you would have no other alternative..
to give up voluntarily would mean a diferent lifestyle for you, but with the assurance of a regular income and a reasonable job, i think most of you would cave in at about £30,000, afterall, if your contacts were understanding, theres no reason why you dont keep in touch, and grab a single profit each night after work, if you can do 5 nights a week and make £50 on each visit, thats about £700 a week.
How much would it take for you to quit playing machines FT?
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sir ratholer
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All this advocating part time playing puzzles me!
I'm presuming none of you have families you like to see, or hobbies you like to do in the evenings?
Spyder you are right few of us would walk into a job but I dont think you give anywhere near enough credit for the intelligence of some members/players. A good few could have been/could still be successful in the work or business environment, and in the unlikely event of machines being outlawed or the more likely event of being unplayable, I for one would not be rushing out to get a minimum wage job. I'd be starting a business asap, with a few ideas I have.
A few of us on here could even get together and start something. How about forming the biggest and crucially most efficient machine distribution company
in the uk? Wouldn't be hard to beat the competition!
I'm presuming none of you have families you like to see, or hobbies you like to do in the evenings?
Spyder you are right few of us would walk into a job but I dont think you give anywhere near enough credit for the intelligence of some members/players. A good few could have been/could still be successful in the work or business environment, and in the unlikely event of machines being outlawed or the more likely event of being unplayable, I for one would not be rushing out to get a minimum wage job. I'd be starting a business asap, with a few ideas I have.
A few of us on here could even get together and start something. How about forming the biggest and crucially most efficient machine distribution company
in the uk? Wouldn't be hard to beat the competition!
Bored of the grind.
Interesting point!
Pretty sure we could hump gamestec in customer service / needs / security, we could even profile games to certain pub types to maximise revenue. And we could definitely make better custom games than the "exclusive to gamestec" dross.
But it would be a very hard market to penetrate and would require a huge startup sum, dunno if the banks would lend to a bunch of professional gamblers!
Had a good idea related to fruits a while ago, and its unique, and could definitely work, but now is not the time...
Pretty sure we could hump gamestec in customer service / needs / security, we could even profile games to certain pub types to maximise revenue. And we could definitely make better custom games than the "exclusive to gamestec" dross.
But it would be a very hard market to penetrate and would require a huge startup sum, dunno if the banks would lend to a bunch of professional gamblers!
Had a good idea related to fruits a while ago, and its unique, and could definitely work, but now is not the time...
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toothless11
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- Location: Down south where the girls don't wear them
This is an interesting point about starting up yur own fruity bussiness/distribution or whatever.
I thought of this loads of times but theres one huge problem..
As a group of proffessionals we Know what we enjoy best, I.E gameplay, streak profiles, style of game, aesthetic value etc etc... I think we would tend to 'lean' towards old crest style/ reds etc.. (I know I would).
But is this what the actual Uk public want? They love m/c s with shit gameplay but the tendancy of winning big on a feature, I.E deals/ it's amasings etc.
I think if we ever did try and manufacture/distribute fruits, our proffessional tendacies would break through... Some of us would want to release machines which we could win out of etc... I don't think it would last.... If you wanted to make serious money and for it to work, we would have to 100% commit to this fulltime job... No playing.. And you would have to release the worst but playable machines ever, to maximise profit margins. I.e jackpots that rock and roll/gold rush/money magic et al..
Saying that, if there were no proffessionals at all... Red gaming machines would make more money than deal or no deals I reckon..
Also, I might add, and this is not directed at anyone on here. But when times have got tough and people decide to go get jobs, it distinguishes between those who have the faith/mental capabilities and discipline and knowledge/experience in playing fulltime to the 'rats' who just decide to start playing because they hear it's possible to make dough out of fruits... It's happened loads during, extreme/red days, happened again with dig it's and cluedos and then again with juice boxes. I understand completely if your getting fed up with fire pubs, getting grief etc etc,, but if the money was still top notch these factors wouldn't even be a problem... Like I said, this is no way directed at anyone on here, it's just some personal frustration that is an occurance round my way.
I'm not saying things are shit now, it's far from that. You'll soon see, how many people have quit playing fulltime and got jobs. And when fresh clues come out the amount of people who will be quitting theirs jobs to cone back playing again. -_-
I thought of this loads of times but theres one huge problem..
As a group of proffessionals we Know what we enjoy best, I.E gameplay, streak profiles, style of game, aesthetic value etc etc... I think we would tend to 'lean' towards old crest style/ reds etc.. (I know I would).
But is this what the actual Uk public want? They love m/c s with shit gameplay but the tendancy of winning big on a feature, I.E deals/ it's amasings etc.
I think if we ever did try and manufacture/distribute fruits, our proffessional tendacies would break through... Some of us would want to release machines which we could win out of etc... I don't think it would last.... If you wanted to make serious money and for it to work, we would have to 100% commit to this fulltime job... No playing.. And you would have to release the worst but playable machines ever, to maximise profit margins. I.e jackpots that rock and roll/gold rush/money magic et al..
Saying that, if there were no proffessionals at all... Red gaming machines would make more money than deal or no deals I reckon..
Also, I might add, and this is not directed at anyone on here. But when times have got tough and people decide to go get jobs, it distinguishes between those who have the faith/mental capabilities and discipline and knowledge/experience in playing fulltime to the 'rats' who just decide to start playing because they hear it's possible to make dough out of fruits... It's happened loads during, extreme/red days, happened again with dig it's and cluedos and then again with juice boxes. I understand completely if your getting fed up with fire pubs, getting grief etc etc,, but if the money was still top notch these factors wouldn't even be a problem... Like I said, this is no way directed at anyone on here, it's just some personal frustration that is an occurance round my way.
I'm not saying things are shit now, it's far from that. You'll soon see, how many people have quit playing fulltime and got jobs. And when fresh clues come out the amount of people who will be quitting theirs jobs to cone back playing again. -_-
If I were to run a machine distribution network, the first thing I would do is make every machine ethernet capable, and get them to report input/output and target % at set intervals back to a company server. In the event of non-communication, the machine will run as normal, but the absence of data would be investigated. Pretty much every pub has internet/wifi these days, so it wouldn't be an issue.
This could also eliminate non-payout claims etc. as the barman could just phone a number, and the operator could whip up their web browser, log in and bring up the machine in question. They can see how much is owed instantly and the reason why, and authorise the pub to pay the punter.
This way, the company could quite easily proactively float machines, find out which machines are being tooled fairly easily, find out which machines are being emptied very easily, and only send collectors to areas that have taken enough money.
In this game, data and statistics are key. Why on earth none of the main players in the industry have upped their game can only be attributed to either incompetence or complacency.
This could also eliminate non-payout claims etc. as the barman could just phone a number, and the operator could whip up their web browser, log in and bring up the machine in question. They can see how much is owed instantly and the reason why, and authorise the pub to pay the punter.
This way, the company could quite easily proactively float machines, find out which machines are being tooled fairly easily, find out which machines are being emptied very easily, and only send collectors to areas that have taken enough money.
In this game, data and statistics are key. Why on earth none of the main players in the industry have upped their game can only be attributed to either incompetence or complacency.
"If only there were evil people somewhere insidiously committing evil deeds, and it were necessary only to separate them from the rest of us and destroy them. But the line dividing good and evil cuts through the heart of every human being. And who is willing to destroy a piece of his own heart?"
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sir ratholer
- Senior Member
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- Location: Anywhere in the south east
To be honest if I had a machine company I would not have a single playable! As I'd want to keep major pubcos happy.
If I was going to start up I'd buy cheap machines which I knew were unplayable and go from there.
Also a good selling point if it ever was to happen would be that we could say that as we are a group of (ex) professional players we will be able to keep tabs on tricks and other things before the companies due to our contacts...
If I was going to start up I'd buy cheap machines which I knew were unplayable and go from there.
Also a good selling point if it ever was to happen would be that we could say that as we are a group of (ex) professional players we will be able to keep tabs on tricks and other things before the companies due to our contacts...
Bored of the grind.
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sir ratholer
- Senior Member
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Also I 100% agree with blackmogu in every sense and feel that the industry is definitely complacent and lazy. If I had a company I or my employees would be poring over statistics making sure the site/machine was making me money.
Obviously the technology thing he advocates would probably cost a fair bit but would be a fantastic way of eliminating fraud and maximizing profitability - and efficiency.
If there is a more inefficient industry than fruit machine distribution I'm yet to see it!
Obviously the technology thing he advocates would probably cost a fair bit but would be a fantastic way of eliminating fraud and maximizing profitability - and efficiency.
If there is a more inefficient industry than fruit machine distribution I'm yet to see it!
Bored of the grind.
Take away the professionals and fruit machine would make the companies a hell of a lot less.
How many £s do you think the pros put into machines everyday? 78% payout giving a company a 22p profit for every quid put in.
On a night out I would guess a player could cycle through a couple of grand in credits. Even £2000 would give £440 profit.
You can see why Barcrest stick tricks in and why Bell Fruit are following on! Take away the tricks, you take away the players and are left with beer change munters and the odd addict.
So would a fruit machine company work if playables are a thing of the past? No.
How many £s do you think the pros put into machines everyday? 78% payout giving a company a 22p profit for every quid put in.
On a night out I would guess a player could cycle through a couple of grand in credits. Even £2000 would give £440 profit.
You can see why Barcrest stick tricks in and why Bell Fruit are following on! Take away the tricks, you take away the players and are left with beer change munters and the odd addict.
So would a fruit machine company work if playables are a thing of the past? No.
The pro isn't going to lose £440, though.
If a pro, through his, skill, knowledge and tactics wins, say £50 for every £2000 put in he is getting 102.5% payout.
Then everyone else who plays must be getting worse value.
If it takes another £10000 worth of spins to meet percentage then it will be paying 73% to level out at 78%.
If I ran a pub, I would honestly set it as high as possible and put notices up stating so. Then again, it would appear that some places don't give a hoot about their punters. Or maybe, this has been tried and cost them money.
If a pro, through his, skill, knowledge and tactics wins, say £50 for every £2000 put in he is getting 102.5% payout.
Then everyone else who plays must be getting worse value.
If it takes another £10000 worth of spins to meet percentage then it will be paying 73% to level out at 78%.
If I ran a pub, I would honestly set it as high as possible and put notices up stating so. Then again, it would appear that some places don't give a hoot about their punters. Or maybe, this has been tried and cost them money.
Roulette free since December 2011.
Most suppliers/distributors don't give a fuck how much the machine makes or whether it gets battered by pros. It's not their money inside it. It's the rental agreement that matters to them. If a certain machine doesn't perform well in one environment they move it to another.
The big suppliers normally have rental only deals, the independants normally have a split %age deal/cut.
Empties really only cost the pubs money, not the supplier or manufacturer(other than the small cost of a few hundred new chips) and a few extra site visits for the suppliers.
That's why people like gamestec are so lax and customer service is pretty much non existant. They've probably got pubs tied to lengthy contracts, so if a machine is off or fucked or performing badly they'll get round to it in their own time!! Which fuckwit-tecs case is about a month!!!
It seems some people are confused by the difference of a supplier to a manu.
But agreed with mogu/rath it wouldn't be difficult to outperform gamestec/Essex leisure etc with good ideas/information flow etc. But that technology costs money and u couldn't really compete with the bigger suppliers in terms of rental agreements. At the end of the day some pubs have regular rowers some don't.
The big suppliers normally have rental only deals, the independants normally have a split %age deal/cut.
Empties really only cost the pubs money, not the supplier or manufacturer(other than the small cost of a few hundred new chips) and a few extra site visits for the suppliers.
That's why people like gamestec are so lax and customer service is pretty much non existant. They've probably got pubs tied to lengthy contracts, so if a machine is off or fucked or performing badly they'll get round to it in their own time!! Which fuckwit-tecs case is about a month!!!
It seems some people are confused by the difference of a supplier to a manu.
But agreed with mogu/rath it wouldn't be difficult to outperform gamestec/Essex leisure etc with good ideas/information flow etc. But that technology costs money and u couldn't really compete with the bigger suppliers in terms of rental agreements. At the end of the day some pubs have regular rowers some don't.
A pro isn't gonna lose. Machine are set to %. Win or lose for every pound in they make 22p.
Player walk into a pub. There's a Perfect Game and a Smash The Cash next to each other. Both have noties on. Which does he play? Next player walks in couple of hours later, which does he play? Munter has a go a few hours later? Which does he play? Probably the perfect game but he's not gonna row it like smash has been twice already.
Player walk into a pub. There's a Perfect Game and a Smash The Cash next to each other. Both have noties on. Which does he play? Next player walks in couple of hours later, which does he play? Munter has a go a few hours later? Which does he play? Probably the perfect game but he's not gonna row it like smash has been twice already.
Makes no difference. While players are about cash boxes are full. Take players away and they not.BFK wrote:
It seems some people are confused by the difference of a supplier to a manu.
Would you have a machine in your pub if it was making fuck all? I guess if the cash box covers the tax you pay then that's fine. How much do all fees/taxes come too anyone? Not a clue lol.
im not being like that, but in the job climate any level of job application will be met by other applicants who were doing the same job elsewhere and only left because of redundancy.. leaving pretty much eveey avenue of employment closed for people who have such a gap on a cv.Glendale wrote:Good to see you hold us in high regard spyder? By the way are you a qualified chef or a microwave king? :-)
fair play if anyone intends to start a business, although in most instances you will require rock solid credit ratings and own at least one house to put up for security against bank accounts and business finance (regardless of cash in the bank you are going to need other securities)
no, im not qualified, but it wouldnt make a difference to me either way at the minute.
Spa - couldn't disagee more - we do put monies in the cash box, and a fair whack, but if players never existed the machines would get played a lot more by punters and take even more into the cashbox. I'm talking in the grand scheme of things, not just a pub that no player visists. Also I'm assuming when you say "player" you mean professional, and not just anyone.
Toothless, got disagee with you too. Simply that even "top notch money" will not justify the grief and hassle thats getting worse and worse nowadays. Some of us are reasonably well off and when the cash isn't as important, getting more isn't a great motivation. I'm pretty sure I wont be alone in saying that either. Ironically, the money will have to get a lot worse so your absoluley forced to have to put up with the shit to justify it. Thats just my opinion tho.
Finally, networking units with live connections wouldn't be *that* expensive to setup. Especially when you think of the benefits it could bring... It really is a joke its not been done properly yet.
Toothless, got disagee with you too. Simply that even "top notch money" will not justify the grief and hassle thats getting worse and worse nowadays. Some of us are reasonably well off and when the cash isn't as important, getting more isn't a great motivation. I'm pretty sure I wont be alone in saying that either. Ironically, the money will have to get a lot worse so your absoluley forced to have to put up with the shit to justify it. Thats just my opinion tho.
Finally, networking units with live connections wouldn't be *that* expensive to setup. Especially when you think of the benefits it could bring... It really is a joke its not been done properly yet.